[Patrick Reolon]

As far as I know, concerning the sound, the reed strength should really make no difference (I am summing up my physics knowledge, and the sound is in fact more in the reed cut/form than its strength).
The Reed strength is just a compensation for the human organism (diafragma strength, lung volume, lip strength and gut).
So there is no need train for higher reed stregths, in fact I believe everybody is different and for some people a lower number may be the natural limit, but this should in no way affect the sound produced…

[Patrick Reolon]

Thanks for the RRRRRoooling advice… I will try all suggestions concerning the growling.
It’s not you (tenor sax) it’s me, so I’ll keep on trying…

Wayne, concerning your questions:
Why try a stronger reed:
It’s an habit I got from my clarinette teacher when I was a child yet. I don’t remember the exact explanation, but in my case my teacher recommended me to go up in strength with the time. I assume it’s a physical training issue: when you do sports, e.g. weightlifting, with the time you need to put more weight on to keep on traing, except when you’re at top you mantain the weight to train endurance… when you run you have to run longer distances to force you over the edge. though with the time you train specific distances for endurance.
In my case when I try a softer reed, it just squeaks all the time or I close the reed directly with the pressure of my air-column… a too hard reed forces me to put too much strength on my air column to make it vibrate…

Is it bad to fluctuate between the two:
Depending on the distance between the thicknesses I would believe. In my case, it is hard to go to a much softer reed, because of the muscle-memory… It takes me now to much (mental /concentration) effort to blow into a horn with much softer reeds, I have to over-control all my muscles (belly, gut, lips, etc) to be able to produce some sound, but generally the reed or blocks or squeaks when it’s too soft.
If the reed thicknesses are close, then I believe it could be a good exercise to use different thicknesses. It can even be an application issue: for some styles thinner ones than for others…

BUT as a parentesis:
The Vandoren Java reeds are a kind of overlabled, a Java 4 Reed corresponds folowing Vandorens own images, to a traditional 3 1/2
http://www.becsetanches.com/img/cms/illustration/tableau-compsax-EN.png
Even though the grafics is misleading: The Java Green 4 is thinner than a ZZ 4. A java green 4 I put it on my mouthpiece and instantly I get a controlled sound. A ZZ 4
I first have to soften it to be able to blow a sound of my horn, and it takes me more effort… Java Red 4 are only a tiny way harder than Java Green 4.

I would suggest, if you want try a thicker one, try it as a reference, you’ll notice if it’s to hard or not… But if you feel comfortable where you are in the sense of control over the sound, I think it’s not necessarily needed to go up, it’s not a competition. Only when you notice that a too soft reed is blocking your hability to play smooth (e.g. when it forces you to over-control the strength applied, when it shuts the opening too often) then it’s good to change to a thicker one… If you feel comfortbale and just play without thinking to much, you’ve got the right thickness…
A reed is just a tool to give you the best control over your instrument.

[Patrick Reolon]

Hi,
Thanks for the advices, it’s definitively not in my plans to give up 😉

I’ve played on #4 reeds for years now… softer ones are for me weird, it seems I have brute/strong embochure. I’ve played clarinette for several years and got used to the strongest reeds. perhaps not the best habit.

I’ll take the advices and start with humming and work up…
Johnny, your questions make me think that perhaps I used a “too brute” approach in general also my air pressure from the lungs could be too harsh for the vocal chords… hmmmmmmmmmm makes me think….

[Patrick Reolon]

Just recently I asked at P.Mauriat for caretaking tipps for my unlaquered saxophone.

I have in mind they recommended me as an option to use car wax to seal the surface…
“…The unlacquered finish is supposed to appear aged and look similar to a vintage saxophone over time. If you want to try and retain it’s color I would suggest cleaning it with a damp cloth then applying liquid wax (car wax). There is no way to remove the brown marks other than to use a fine steel wool which will take off the existing unlacquer color as well…
A good resource for learning minor repairs (and a lot of good general saxophone information) is this forum: http://forum.saxontheweb.net/forumdisplay.php?54-Sax-Repair-Maintenance-and-Modification
”

But on a laquered saxophones it doesn’t make too much sense to me, that’s what the laquer is for, to protect and seal the metal. Just wipe it with a soft cloth. car wax would be an additional (unnecessary) layer on it…

Aditionally I’ve read pretty much on caretaking of unlaquered saxophones and indeed, a little bit of lemon juice mixed with water helps on removing green copper and cleaning unlaquered saxophones from saliva or water marks, giving them a shiny surface again if wanted, without really damaging the metal…

[Patrick Reolon]

Thank you Johnny for the quick solution, now it’s working… thumbs up!

I didn’t think about the email adress matching.
I will keep that in mind for future purchases.

Best regards

Patrick

[Patrick Reolon]

Hi Johnny,
Yeah, switzerland beautiful, but expensive. upside and downside… heheh

Thanks, your courses will be of big help improving my playing. I live in southern chile and good horn players to learn from them are hard to find or some hours drive away.

Most interesting to come here, was the change from european ways of playing the sax to the Latin Style, which is more percussive,more as fill up; as in the funk.
I was astonished to see and hear, that sax in latin music is used much more in staccato way. It’s just a fill up, whereas in other styles as in blues or rock, the european or north-american way, the sax is used more like a 2nd voice, like a background singer.
Thus the sax and it’s player have another role in a band. In our band we had several discussions concerning my way of playing sax, which is intuitively more like a 2nd voice, and not as they were used to: a horn making percussive fillings like a trumpet.

I’ll keep you updated about worth mentioning and instructive issues 😉 off course.

Best regards

Patrick

[Patrick Reolon]

Hi all,

I’m Patrick, born in Switzerland, from spanish mother and half italian half swiss father, I’m actually living now in Chile.

I enjoy playing a Tenor Sax P.Mauriat Pmxt-66rul
with a Ottolink 8* mouthpiece (earlier Vandoran Java T45)
and Vandoren Java Green #4 reeds

I’ve played over 8 years clarinette before changing to the Tenor Sax (which I wanted to play originally).
After some years of Sax lessons I’ve played in a swiss Rock Band for two years and when I’ve moved to Chili some years ago, I first played in a Funk based band and then I got to be co-founder in a successful and uprising Cumbia-Rock-Band “Combo Chabela” for more than two years now.

I consider my actual level as intermediate because I was for years out of practice as a lack of discipline or proyection because of missing band-projects.
Now as I’m embarked in a project again, there’s no excuse. My years of practice gave me in fact a pro bed, but to keep a pro you just have to keep on practicing, what I didn’t do.
The courses Johnny has made cover at 100% my needs: Basic exercise routine, some playing tricks from a pro, and Altissimo.

So thanks to Johnny, hi and best regards to all

Patrick

[Patrick Reolon]

Hmmmm…
yes, they do not last as long as other reeds, that’s for sure (I imagine that the way they’re built is more fragile, they get quicker much thinner on the edges than traditional cuts/reed-profiles (something you can see/verify in the profiles of the reeds as seen in the catalogue)). But at the same time, they give me much nicer expression possibilities.
At the same time I made the experience, that a metal mouthpiece reduces the lifetime of the reeds additionally. with my T45 I was able to play the reeds some weeks more than with the metal mouthpiece… (or is it just my embochure technique ?)
I use Java Green #4 and normally can play right ahead without any bigger pre-soaking: From the box to my mouth on my sax and play.
The good ones I can use them for aprox 2 months, stable behaviour, the worse reeds last a month or less.

The zz as the java reeds have a different strength numbering within Vandoren.
A java & ZZ #3 is traditional 2 1/2, #4 is trad. 3 1/2 etc.
that is directly related to the reed-profile.
So perhaps you could try the ZZ or Java in a higher strength, because: what’s for you soggy is for me more flexibility in expression. I mean literally the first while the #4 reeds for me are a little harder, make me work harder on the embochure, but when they get soft, I can take full profit out of their higher flexibility.

I will actually try the zz soon, and the Java Red, I have some gonzalez local jazz reeds too, but with the Java greens I feel like i can tame the reed much more and use them to a higher extent, but they don’t last too long, as a negative point…

[Patrick Reolon]

I agree.
The technicisms help only once you’re familiar and have chosen your favorites.
For beginners there’s simply nothing around testing, testing and testing different reeds and eventually mouthpieces.

But once you have your favorites and you keep on playing them for a while, have changed mouthpieces or heard a new tip about new reeds to use, the scale helps to check which hardness to try out or the catalogue can help to see in which way the reeds may behave. just as a reference. then, you have to test.

I’m very happy with my java Greens on a ottolink mouthpiece (and before a vandoren T45), but here I’ve read about the ZZ reeds (which I haven’t tried out yet), so the catalogue would be pretty helpful to see which reed strength I need and in which way a change could affect my embochure technique and even sound-shape.

OH: PD: I recently remembered that my first clarinette teacher had a reed clipper. It is used to clip the very tip of a reed once it’s worn out (no bigger clippings) to prolongue lifetime of reeds. Specially for out belovedand rare fantastic reeds. But I have no feedback on that one yet, first have to make my experiences.

[Patrick Reolon]

Frank:
Jumps allways will mean an adaptation fase (embouchure technique) and is individually, depending on how good your trained on the actual mouthpiece.
My presonal believe is that a change of more than 20 is a bigger challenge, but depends on your individual traning-situation if it’s easy or a bigger challenge.
Psychologically minor steps are better so that traning efforts do not exceed.

Some years ago I changed from a Selmer S80C* (.75 opening) to Vandoren T45 (.90). I had several years of good training on the S80, so that change was for me a relief, I suddenly got much more control over my sound, I liked the sound better and I have to admit it didn’tcost me much effort, because I changed reeds too. But before deciding I was able to test 3 or 4 mouthpieces. my local dealer allowed me to take them home for testing purposes, I don’t remember all the choices, butI kept to the T45.

a few months ago I changed from the rubber T45 (.90) to a metal Ottolink 8*(110). This change was a bigger challenge but I honestly don’t know if it was more the material change, the opening or both.

Making it short: If you’re able to test them before buying do it, and try a second option less open.
When buying new reeds, mouthpieces, or any accessoire for sax, as they are not the cheapest, it’s always best try before buy.
If you can’t test, depending. If you need it for live situations I’d recommend a smaller step (90 max), like this you garantee that you can use the new mouthpiece with little bit more effort under live-pressure (faster adaptation). If you have unlimited training time I think you can with patience.

Just have in mind: the bigger the jump, the longer adaptation and traing time and more pacience you need, as you invest more exercise time in your new embouchure technique and sound and less in fingerings.

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